Moderate Muslim: Where Are All The Moderate White Christians Denouncing Planned Parenthood Shooting?

One Muslim resident of Colorado is wondering when all white Christians will denounce the perpetrator of the Planned Parenthood Shooting.

HIGHLAND, COLORADO — Anika Kaber is a 27-year-old resident of Colorado, and her town is not far from Colorado Springs — the scene of a deadly attack on a Planned Parenthood clinic there on Friday, November 27th, 2015. Kaber said she was “sickened” by the news of the shooting not far from her town, and that she was outraged that more moderate, white Christians haven’t denounced the shooting as an act of terrorism, as so many demand of her whenever an act of terror is carried out in another part of the world under the banner of Islamic terrorism.

Though the exact motive of the alleged shooter, Robert Lewis Dear is still not clear enough for authorities to have made any comments on them as of yet, Kaber feels the shooter’s target alone gives one a pretty good clue. Citing the recent videos put out by the Center for Medical Progress — a right-wing fundamentalist anti-abortion group that has been widely accused of doctoring, splicing, removing context and completely inventing it when necessary — Kaber feels that anti-abortion passions have been inflamed among those she calls “right-wing Christian radicals with gun collections” and that “no moderate or progressive Christian would attack the Planned Parenthood building like that.”

“I just want to know why I have to get down on bended knee and ask for forgiveness from the entire western world,” Kaber told our reporter, “every time some asshole who has twisted my religion up commits an act of violence, but whenever some delusional, white, gun toting religious fundamentalist shoots up a Planned Parenthood or a black church in South Carolina, it’s immediately labeled the act of a lone wolf or someone clearly not indicative of Christianity as a whole?” Kaber said that kind of “built-in double standard” is why “this country still has a wink-wink and not approach to the Ku Klux Klan” but why she and her fellow Islamic Americans “have to be put through sixteen levels of screening” when traveling.

The rarity of Islamic terrorist attack on American soil, Kaber said, also leads to her ire over the reaction of white, Christian conservatives to things like the shooting in Colorado Springs. “I mean, I get it, 9/11 was terrible,” Kaber said, “but what kind of idiot thinks we Muslims weren’t burying our own victims that day? Do you think no Muslims died in the Twin Towers that day? We cried right along with every American that day. And the fact is that since that day far, far more Americans have been killed in domestic mass shooting events than have been killed in Islamic terrorist attacks. So why do they insist,” she asked rhetorically, “on demanding that I apologize for the Paris attacks and specifically condemn those psychopaths, but they get to just put their hands up and slide-step six paces to the right away from this Planned Parenthood shooter?”

“I just want America to be the kind of country where I don’t have to denounce assholes that have nothing to do with me,” Kaber said as she was ending the interview, “and where other people don’t have to fall on the sword for people they don’t know. That’s not American. That’s not even common sense. We need to get back to the place where it’s just presumed that good people condemn bad people, no matter what political or religious group they belong to. But until that day comes, yeah, I’m going to speak out every time a white, middle-aged, Christian fundamentalist goes on an anti-abortion killing spree and the same bastards who demand that I bow and scrape to them over the Paris attacks don’t immediately condemn people of their own ilk. Sue me.”

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WHITE Christians?? So if a BLACK christian says nothing, that is ok?? I REALLY think you USA people need to get a grip of your racial (although it isnt even racial! it is as superficial as skin color!)catagorisation! You make MASSIVE generalising segregated catagories based on skin color! And you WONDER why your country has so many problems. Even the people who think they are fighting AGAINST racism are racist! What a STATE of affairs!

Here’s the rub: as an atheist I absolutely hold Christians to account for the insanity of their redicals! I place on all Christians the burden of washing away, minimizing, and eliminating radical views from within their ranks. I hold all Christians to account for everything from west burrow to telling AIDS stricken rural Africans not to use condoms. Because the west burrow people think moderate Christians are interpreting the book wrong; they think you are too moderate. The radicals aren’t pulling these views out of thin air! As far as they are concerned it’s in the book. Therefore, it is up to Christians to denounce the radical views some get from the Bible and to engage in theological debate that drives that goal. Furthermore, productive theological debate can only take place within the ranks of the religion. West burrow is so marginal in the 21st century because Christians have worked to purge those views. Many Christians make a point of indicating, “I don’t hate queer people, though.” Nonetheless, when one of yours shoots up an abortion clinic I expect you to do more! So, Muslims, I place the same burden on you! Now get to work.

(Fair I’ve done little to address the fact that maybe not enough people see it this way. The fact that not enough Christians take the responsibility or think they should. But I’m giving it to them and thus also to Muslims)

How does not liking the idea of killing babies make you a Christian?
Muslims think it is okay to rape women that are in public alone. Does that make all rapist Muslim?

No one wants you on one knee to apologize, and no one is asking you to bow and scrape, poor girl.

And I do not feel the slightest need to apologize for the planned parent hood bomber.  But I want him in jail or executed.  And the damn Republican candidates “encouraged” this with their debate performance while pandering to the far right of their party.  Unforgivable to me. Imagine, they merely mentioned this issue in a few debates, and people attribute this shooting to them.  JUST THINK ABOUT ALL THE RADICAL IMAN’S PREACHING WEEK AFTER WEEK, about wholesale killing, and being rewarded with 72 virgins!!!!  Yes, goddammit it, SOMEONE needs to APOLOGIZE for that murderous behavior !!!!!  Is it any wonder that young impressionable minds subjected to this hate will act on it? 

ALL religious fanatics are complete idiots, Islamic (72 virgins, ha ha ha!) or Christian or Jewish or other.  ANY preachers who advocate similar actions or even sentiments should be defrocked by their religion and jailed by the state.  This goes double for muslim clerics who would come to America and preach Islamic hate, that is simply called treason. This “freedom of religion” loophole needs to be CLOSED immediately, since Islam is without question a totalitarian ideology as much as it is a religion.  You think passages that demand violent proselytization and overthrow of one’s host country are ok? It’s simply Treason.  Capital Offense. Execute or deport them. Imans and congregants BOTH.

That is the main reason Donald Trump has a following, he would be the only one not coward enough to say it and implement actual policy and enforce it.

The problem is the verses in the Koran that exhort and demand expansion by violent means.

And EVERYWHERE IN THE WORLD that Islam, and Muslims, bump up against another culture, that little 5% to 15% of muslims who of course NOBODY claims, except the radical “IMANS” who create them, wreak VIOLENT BLOODY HAVOC, in the name of the beloved prophet and Allah.  It’s in the book.  Period.  Pretending the book does not say what it says, or denying it, or being oblivious to it, is NOT OK.

It is NOT OK that you cannot build churches in the middle east, it is NOT ok to kill homosexuals, and violent jihad is not ok.  And the BULLSHIT notion that jihad is a peaceful internal battle only, and that violent external jihad is not strongly encouraged, and that Islam is peaceful – these false notions are TAQIYYA, which, if you don’t know is lying sanctioned by “God’s messenger” while waiting to gain the upper hand, at which time you force conversion and implement your “law”.

Is the world really going to accept people walking around in every country with sign’s saying:

“Behead those who insult the prophet”?

That is madness, and the fact it is occurring at all is unbelievable.  The refugee crisis and the idea that tens and hundreds of thousands of un-westernized  are going to be walking around our country is not ok.  College students better ask them to stay out of their “safe zones.”

Let’s face it, the prophet was a single man who personally beheaded hundreds (who had taken him in as guest) who lived 1300 years ago.  His adherents who are fundamentalist want to follow the verses below, is this remotely permissible:

Quran (2:191-193) – “And kill them wherever you find them, and turn them out from where they have turned you out. And Al-Fitnah [disbelief] is worse than killing…but if they desist, then lo! Allah is forgiving and merciful.  And fight them until there is no more Fitnah [disbelief and worshipping of others along with Allah] and worship is for Allah alone.  But if they cease, let there be no transgression except against Az-Zalimun [the polytheists, and wrong-doers, etc.].”

Quran (8:12) – “I will cast terror into the hearts of those who disbelieve. Therefore strike off their heads and strike off every fingertip of them”

Quran (9:5) – “So when the sacred months have passed away, then slay the idolaters wherever you find them”

This is not just out of context, there’s much more, and the “15%” is serious.
You should quit.

Where is your evidence that this man or woman (as Robert was registered as a voter) was a Christian at the time of the shooting?

The burden of proof is on Anika

What I find amazing is the lack of awareness shown in this article. While the author decries stereotyping muslims, we have this pearl-“Though the exact motive of the alleged shooter, Robert Lewis Dear is still not clear enough for authorities to have made any comments on them as of yet, Kaber feels the shooter’s target alone gives one a pretty good clue.” Without a shred of evidence. In fact, the little we do know paints him in a picture that suggests he surely is not a Christian. Hypocrisy is apparently lost on so many…

What the f—? A lot of us white people are denouncing this and calling it right wing christian terrorism. Do u not read the blogs? Whoever wrote this is full of shit.

What does this have to do with the right wing? Should I then relate all extremist Islamic attacks to the left? Asinine…

There are those on the right wing saying that the people who got shot at PP deserved it. You will not find these people on the left.

I’m sure there are and because of those few it damns the whole?

“You will not find these people on the left.”

That’s quite a statement. So what about those individuals who made boorish remakes at cops funerals? Did those cops deserve it too?

Are they Christians?
Antichrist?
Whoever accepts the Jesus as their God is an Antichrist.
Christ said that, “I died because of your sins (ego)”
This means if you eliminate your ego, you can experience the Christ within you.
All religions are equal & single philosophy.
Understand the difference between LORD & GOD
?
The death of the self (God) of Jesus and the birth of the selfless Christ pbuh ⏩ CHRISTMAS / XMAS
?
The death of the self (God/Allah) of Ahamed Musthafa and the birth of the selfless prophet Muhammad pbuh ⏩ MILADUN NABIY.
?
The death of the self (God/Bodisatva) of Siddhartha and the birth of the selfless Gauthama pbuh ⏩ WESAK
?
These are spiritualities (Reality) not physical entities.
?
G O D ▶ Avaricious, evolving in delusion.
Worship ▶ Wore-ship ▶ Yaa ▶ Remove one.
LORD (Rabb)▶Consciousness
Within your consciousness, all prophets and saints are alive (Oneness)
Activate your selfless bliss by talking to them.
?
Understand your religions,
Through ACRONYMS ⏩⏩⏩ ENGLISH & ARABIC
TRUE ESSENCE OF RELIGIONS’ To unite all
http://Www.fazelsubian.com

Sorry, no cigar. You cannot compare a religion with hundreds of crazy nuts running around doing crappy stuff whose religious books never ordered them to do it …….. to …….. a religion with hundreds of thousands of crazy nuts running around doing crappy stuff and can point to verses in their book of religion that orders them to do it.

Like you never read the Bible brother …..it’s a violent place to be with very violent instructions.

Well. I do denounce hatred. And this crazy jerk… but to answer the question of why. Because only crazy get the media attention. Of course most christians would ever applaud this. But just like when a tornado rips a town up they pick the crazy guy still holding a beer and wearing only his undies and an open robe, to talk about it. Because crazy hate sells.

She is obviously unaware and too young to know of the planned parenthood attacks in the late 80’s till the mid 90s. As soon as it became apparent what the hell was actually happeneing Christians did come together and shut that shit down. And guess what? it Stopped!! Muslims need to do the same. Shut it down!

Wait, so the attacks on Planned Parenthood have been going on for the last thirty years, and you think this is a good thing? Did you even read this before you posted it?

You’re playing dumbass now Christine…..
Muslims have little to do with the actions of ISIS and terrorism.
There are almost two BILLION of them out there.
The handful that have gone berserk is the equivalent of the handful of nutty Christians killing at pro choice clinics.
ISIS-aligned people can apologize if they desire…for example the U.S. who brought ISIS to life and financed it….not Muslims.
Read a variety of news sources, not just mainstream propaganda. Hilary Clinton herself admits to the U.S. hand in creating ISIS.
Should we blame all Christianity for all crimes commented by christians?

erm… I haven’t seen any news reports or anything at all that indicates he is a Christian. I have seen, however, many Christians and Christian leaders condemn his actions. If there is some credible evidence that shows that he believed he was a Christian, I would be happy to read it. Thanks!

erm….I haven’t seen any news reports that the Paris terrorists were Muslim….actually not one has been arrested yet…
I have seen however, many Muslim and Muslim leaders condemn the action. If there is some credible evidence that shows that they believed they were Muslim, I would be happy to read it. Thanks!
See how asinine you sound ?

Holy crap, the more of your post I read the more unintelligent you become. Amazing.

So the attackers who are directly linked to ISIS and planned the attack in Syria are not tied to the Islamic faith? you know what ISIS stand for right?

If you haven’t seen the hundreds of news reports stating this then you need to hop on google and pick one… Oh and they haven’t been arrested because the french killed them all.

I hate arguing with dummies but the only people who said they were ISIS affiliated was ISIS themselves.
And Einstein…. If the French gendarmerie killed them all who lived to tell?
Stupidity is infectious so I’m outta here!

You’re like the child who brings down the grade average for the class. We are all glad to see it go back up, don’t let the door hit you.

I myself don’t agree with her.

For someone to have a deep understanding of a country and it’s culture is not easy. Only 2 to 3rd generation do.

Would she make such detailed comments of her culture, religion and country with such openness and determination? I think not.0

Why do you assume that just because she wears a hijab that she’s not a natural born American citizen?

If I am a coward, then you an exemplar of reason and rationality, but I’m having difficulty finding evidence to support that conclusion.

Said it before and I’ll say it again: if that “Good Book” were any good, fundamentalists would the best people a religion has to offer, instead of the worst.

Said it before and I’ll say it again: if that “Good Book” were any good, fundamentalists would be the best people a religion has to offer, instead of the worst for example, the Spanish Inquisition, the Salem Witch hunts and burnings, the Native American genocide, the Crusades…. whoa…the list is long. Darn Bible!

Indeed. You don’t even have to go into the big stuff, or look back in time. Just Google “Quiverfull” and you’ll see all you need to see.

It’s pure evil for that man to have killed people. Plain evil.
I didn’t and don’t post any comments about ISIS commitment to death and with evil desires to kill and then blame a Muslim for not marching to town to stand up to radically motivated Muslims doing the killing and I don’t think it’s fair to do that or ask a Christian to do the same for anyone who wants to kill,claiming to be a Christian ( although the man’s neighbors said he was not a considered religious.)
The media is somewhat to blame for discussions not taking place and building a wall between people. That wall is evil.
It prevents everyone from asking important questions.
Some questions that may be hard to handle, difficult to deal with.
Like, do all Christians want to kill abortion workers?
No person who really seeks Christ and his commands does.
I understand that some Muslims may feel frustrated , who can blame them for that?
I believe that the media has slanted alot of what people feel towards Muslims to be wrong.
That said that same media does no favors for the true Christian faith.
I also don’t think Republicans or Democrats are always truthfully re-presented by the media.
So evil is something we deal with and we can call it that but the media won’t like that either.
For if there is evil then there must be good and we are left with more difficult questions.
Like if there is good and evil there must be right and wrong and then there must be true and false and I must face these things in my own personal life and that makes me vulnerable and I must deal with hard questions about life and purpose.
About love and hate, sadness and joy and all that makes me a human being.
To those who lost loved ones, to you my heart is broken for you.

Why do people say this guy was a crazy “lone wolf”? Could be that he lived alone in a cabin for 10 years without water or electricity, miles and miles away from anyone else…I would call that a lone wolf. Crazy? Did you see his booking photo? Hear what people who knew him said? He couldn’t carry a conversation without becoming incoherent. Just like the guy who shot up the Gabby Giffords rally(In the name of grammar. Yes grammar) or the guy who shot up the theater in Colorado before the Batman movie. They were not doing it for a cause, well perhaps for better grammar. They are saying these guys are nuts, because they are indeed nuts. A bit different than religiously indoctrinated nuttiness. I believe she has a valid point about not feeling like she has to apologize for all violence purpetrated by a Muslim. But I think she is jumping to conclusions here and doing it in a really racist way, which I don’t think is acceptable for anyone to do.

I know exactly what her attempted correlation was. But it holds little to no merit, that is unless you are a racist, or truly believe that Christians are the moral and literal equivalent of ISIS. Which is nonsense. I hold no love whatsoever for organized religion. However, I think it is a false equivalency, and intellectually dishonest. Don’t let your hate blind you. Remember “fear leads to anger, anger leads to hate, and hate leads to suffering” Yoda Parseghian, Jedi Master.

Explain how the shooter was screaming about “baby parts” from a doctored video posted online by a Christian anti-abortion group.
He was connected to extremists.

I don’t know man. Have you seen this guy? The lights are on but nobody is home. Total vacant look. I didn’t know the video was done by a Christian group? Jared Laufner(I think that was his name) was railing about punctuation when he shot Gabby Giffords. We didn’t say he must be affiliated with “School house Rock”. Although I hear if you play “conjunction junction” backwards it says “No commas for you! Next!” Coincidence? Too soon?

He could be an out of work child actor(his appearance may give us a clue as to why he is out of work). He may have been saying “there are no more baby parts” after the film American Sniper used an animatronic baby so convincingly. Just like ATM’s are taking bank jobs, animatronic babies are taking away rolls for babies. Didn’t he also purportedly say “Hodor” as well?

It’s incredible the mental gymnastics you put yourself through to try and rationalize your point.

I think it’s funny that you seem to have gotten that impression; however, I find it less funny that people like you are the reason we can’t have productive conversations on the topic of shootings. Also, clearly I’m not an automaton, have you seen my userpic?

Ah, got it. You are just bad in social situations. Why am I the reason you can’t have a “productive conversation” about shootings? Because I disagree with you? What exactly do you want to “produce” with the conversation. Just a trivial fact, a conversation usually is a two sided thing. What you are inferring to is a “speech” or a monlogue. That’s where one person says what they believe, and a captive audience has to sit and listen.

Well for one thing, you decided that the only point worth engaging in my last to you was the least important to respond to. You know they say brevity is the source of wit, so I can’t really say I’m surprised, given your penchant for paragraphs. Perhaps I need to be more explicit with you?

Actually my first sentence addressed the last topic, and the bulk of my comment addresses the only allegation you made about me. Now, while what is important to you is something I could never quite know, it was important to me to refute a “charge” against me.

No, you see, the bulk of your comment was a condescending ad hominem tangent that neither advanced our dialogue–such as it is!–nor demonstrated that you particularly respect or listen to the words of your conversation partner, and it’s been like that since your first post to this thread. Which is why I find your attempts to sound reasonable terribly amusing.

Your projection is dizzying. It is clear by your posts both to me and on the rest of the thread that you think yours is the only valid opinion. Any deviance from that brings out “evil Matt” that sends his ad hominems in the form of snarky put downs from your ivory tower. I invite you to actually reread our interaction. But for me, this is my stop, I have to go, better things to do and all. Cheers.

It’s cute when you try to use the words I gave you on me, inexpertly. After all, which of the two of us called the other evil? Twice, even! Best of luck with your better things, though!

He saw a video on youtube. Cool, how does that connect him to the group?

So if you watched this video can I associate you with that same group?

The key to fighting political Islamist terrorist groups is solidarity and common cause with peaceful Muslims.

We can’t do that if we hold Muslims to one standard and Christians to another.

I think she has the right to say what she said! Maybe she was expecting our Christian Authority Figures and Leaders to stand up to these Domestic Terrorists from the Right’s Christian Fanatics, and what they are doing almost on a weekly basis. I don’t see any Religious Leader Condemning them! Only the Right inciting these attacks and praising the Shooter as a HERO! Yes, I received a post on FB, that there are republicans cheering him on and saying they don’t care that a pregnant woman may have died or been injured, because she deserved it! There are some really criminal Christians out there thinking its ok to ignore laws and even the Supreme Court on other issues under the Name of God. God was not a shooter, nor a hater, nor a racist, a bigot, a xenophobe or a Christian. Men have made their own interpretations as to what the New Testament said. Jesus would never have encouraged nor praised these criminal acts, just men, as they are doing on the RIGHT. There have been more attacks on Planned Parenthood than there are days of the year, this year, 2015! Google it!

I agree with Anika! Why do Muslims have to defend themselves when a Muslim terrorist attacks in the US or somewhere else, but when a white Christian male commits an act of terrorism (like every other day here in the US), no one is crying for moderate Christians to speak out and denounce these idiots???

IMO, ALL the moderates need to be much, much more vocal against the radicals in their own professed religions! The radicals in ANY group make the entire rest of the group look bad to the rest of society!

Speak out against the radical extremists in your group, unless YOU want to be associated with them.

You know what miss, I’ll tell why. Christians ARE NOT the religion that is literally terrorising the ENTIRE world. Your supremacy cult Aka Islam is absolutely THE lowest form of life. us Christians have our faults but at least WE don’t rape children, stone women to death ,use children as sex slaves , chop people’s heads off literally because we have a different opinion, throw gays off roof tops, burn people alive etc etc…. what you IslamoNAZI’s do around the world-God will deal with you.

Yes you do. Christians do all of those things, and a lot of them right here in America. You don’t even have to look that hard to find examples. Remember that whole Duggars case that as far as I know is still going around? And have you ever taken the time to look into stories of gay kids getting thrown out of their homes or sent to conversion therapy camps by God-fearing Christian parents? Christians have as much capacity to be terrorists as anyone else, and that’s a fact that is being underscored more and more each time something like this happens.

You do realize just lying that your religion doesn’t do that does not make it true for your intended point, correct?
All religions are full of evil. Christianity is so similar to Islam it’s ridiculous how much they hate each other.

So Christians didn’t lead the Crusades into Europe and the Middle East 1000 years ago? One of the many acts of terrorism that Christians have done. Christians like every other group on Earth, has extremists that terrorise everyone else.

Are you really going to try to compare “Islam” and Christians? Just wait…When a 10 year old muslim boy starts chopping you and your families head’s off because you had a spate. I’m pretty sure you will sing a different tune. You have not even began to understand what is happening in this world yet so I’m holding no grudge at all. Remember our talk today ok?

Amazing. I didn’t think it was possible for anyone to make a comment so utterly divorced from reality. On the other hand, I’ve also been judiciously avoiding listening to the Republican debates. But seriously, bravo. I’m impressed at how entirely devoid of any semblance of sense or fact there is to be found in your statements on this forum.

He Who Meddles, the blissfully ignorant. Go on liveleak and watch some videos then bring yourself into reality. Oh and political debates has nothing to do with this you dolt.

If a ten year old of any denomination chops off your head he will be doing the world a great favour.

As i am from a rural place, i have wondered if most people think Christians are like the west burrow freaks. Well we arent. Those of us who actually read the bible know every life is precious.

No one thinks that all Christians are like that. Her point is that people are hypocrites, not that they are terrorists.

Jenn dear….so you think Muslims are any different ?
Just as you believe not all Christians are like Wesbro….most sane people recognize that not all Muslims are like ISIS.

Antichrist?
Whoever accepts the Jesus as their God is an Antichrist.
Christ said that, “I died because of your sins (ego)”
This means if you eliminate your ego, you can experience the Christ within you.
All religions are equal & single philosophy.
Understand the difference between LORD & GOD
?
The death of the self (God) of Jesus and the birth of the selfless Christ pbuh ⏩ CHRISTMAS / XMAS
?
The death of the self (God/Allah) of Ahamed Musthafa and the birth of the selfless prophet Muhammad pbuh ⏩ MILADUN NABIY.
?
The death of the self (God/Bodisatva) of Siddhartha and the birth of the selfless Gauthama pbuh ⏩ WESAK
?
These are spiritualities (Reality) not physical entities.
?
G O D ▶ Avaricious, evolving in delusion.
Worship ▶ Wore-ship ▶ Yaa ▶ Remove one.
LORD (Rabb)▶Consciousness
Within your consciousness, all prophets and saints are alive (Oneness)
Activate your selfless bliss by talking to them.
?
Understand your religions,
Through ACRONYMS ⏩⏩⏩ ENGLISH & ARABIC
TRUE ESSENCE OF RELIGIONS’ To unite all
http://Www.fazelsubian.com

I think mostly it is because as far as I am aware, there is no such thing as ‘The Muslim Leadership’. Every major Christian denomination has a unified ruling body; For the Catholics, the buck stops with the Pope in Rome, for Anglicans the Queen of England and her council of Archbishops, the Eastern Baptist Conference, you name it, SOMEBODY IS IN CHARGE. With Islam, there’s nobody to point to, since leadership doesn’t seem to extend past the local Imam, and the only organized group most people see claiming moral authority for Islam are radicals like ISIL. Am i wrong? Is there a ‘head’ of the Muslim church? Or even just the Shiites or the Sunnis? If so, why haven’t we all heard about them by now? Why arent they releasing press statements every time a terrorist attack happens? With no unified leadership to hold ultimate responsibility for ‘what Muslims believe’, I think most people are worried that any Muslim could be a radical Muslim… And that kind of worry makes people stupid and panicky.

Pro life is not the Christian denomination as a whole.
When ISIS does something, ISIS affiliates should condemn it…..not the entire Muslim World.
I don’t see Christians running to condemn anything.
Take your foggy head out of your Xanax.

Good link? How many times can they fit the phrase “abortion facility” into a single article.
Blatant propagandizing is blatant.
They should just come out and say what they are trying to tiptoe around with their carefully worded statements. “We would *never* hurt anyone! Not even those babykillers going to the infanticide factory to commit murder themselves! I would never judge these women who are obviously only here to slaughter their unborn daughters and sons – that’s the only service provided in these places, after all! – so we ask that you do not judge US! (However, please do feel free to lump the shooter in with those baby-murderer doctors and their homicidal clientele.)”

Nice. Just keep reframing the argument when you don’t have one. The point of the link seems to address the complaint that Christian groups (or anti abortion groups) aren’t denouncing the violence. Well it looks like they are trying to while standing up for what they believe. Sorry if you don’t like that part but it comes with the free speech thing. Highly unlikely they will get air time on a major network. Radical Islam is the first impression most in the west are getting of the Muslim world. If you’re ok with that then stay silent. Or you can be a force to unite people peacefully and agree that radical Islam sucks the same way radical Christainity sucks. Sadly radical Muslims are also killing moderate or normal Muslims. So perhaps it’s fear that keeps them from standing up for their peaceful truth?

You might ask yourself why it seems like the only presentation of Islam that you see is radical Islam when there are all these people who claim that Islam isn’t inherently radical. And if you content yourself with the answer that, ‘this is all we see because this is all there is to see,’ then I would suggest you dig a little deeper and find out whose agenda you’re serving by accepting that response.

I’m content for nothing. There is an abundance of whining and complaining in this country with little accountability and responsibility. If there is an agenda (and there are many in this case) then all the more peaceful Muslims must speak up and better yet “do” peace. Why is that concept so offensive? This should be the mission regardless of “radical Islam”. The public is hungry to see that side of Islam.

Then you will allow that it’s up to Christians to denounce, vocally and vehemently, violence committed by Christians. Because the impression that many people get by watching the United States is that we are a nation gripped with fear of radical evangelical Christianity, because who knows when those guys will snap and shoot up a school or a women’s health clinic?

(You’re making a fallacy argument of false equivalence. You are also making stuff up. Please show references to those people “gripped in fear”?) All the silly arguments aside, all people should denounce all violence. Christians as a community are among the most out front and vocal especially when someone or a group of people claim to murder in the name of Christ. Perfect, no. But they try. Others here have already cited examples. Was the PP shooter christain? What we do know is that he seemed vote liberal and may have idenitified as a woman. With that many in this thread seem to be tone deaf to Islamic RADICALS killing in the name of Allauha for religious purposes. Of course they are a minority as were the radical christains who blew up clinics in the 80’s and 90’s. Which the christain community loudly shut down. Oh, and then there is this guy, the Pope. While I’m not a fan nor defender of his it is hard to get this guy to shut up about peace and unity in these matters. Where is his Islamic peer that lobbies for peace? Where is the Islamic version of Martin Luther King? There is a vacuum waiting for the good but still silent Muslim to step into.

I see, so you pass off your ignorance as proof of an absence of fact. How very droll. There is no such thing as the “Christian community,” and there hasn’t been since the Reformation. Martin Luther King, Jr., was a Baptist who was killed by a Catholic, that same church led by the Pope. If you want an activist in the Muslim world, which also hasn’t been a unified entity at any point in its history, that matches him for importance, you might try looking up the name Malala Yousafzai. As for all those people gripped in fear, how about this segment of the American populous that is still being terrorized: https://storify.com/ClinicEscort/is100enough-how-many or this note from another segment of the American populous that is still being terrorized: http://www.suicide.org/suicide-note-of-a-gay-teen.html
Your accusations of fallacy hold as much merit as your fallacious counterarguments, and your apologist rhetoric betrays your inability to muster a coherent position. Now try that again, but properly this time.

To all the readers of this thread. “He Who Meddles” is unrelenting in his/her straw man arguments and other fallacy attacks for no other reason than to antagonize. Please educate yourself about people like this here http://changingminds.org/disciplines/argument/fallacies/fallacies_alpha.htm this list of fallacy arguments will enable you to understand why this person is doing what they are. Among the goals is to encourage and drive division. I have no doubt there will be a snarky reply to this post. No point in addressing his/her comments when simple Google searches time and again expose his/her fiction… Or worse, tied to an organized PR effort.

Well I hate to disappoint, so: (1. nobody besides you has posted to this thread sooner than three days ago, so I think we can both agree that it’s dead and the only one who cares to address the so-called grievance you are airing is you; (2. providing a list of tools answers the question of how, not why, so great job on that; (3. you seem not to know how the straw man fallacy works, even despite having access to a comprehensive list of fallacies and explanations of how they work, so permit me to educate you: person A makes an argument, person B draws a hyperbolic comparison to person A’s statement with the intention of undermining the validity of person A’s argument. Note that the straw man relies not on the merits of the argument presented, but on the bad associations built into the analogy drawn by the second person.

That was disgusting, actually. That’s the group that released the doctored video that set this shooter off. They don’t condemn it and it’s insulting they assume we would believe it.
Will you research the evidence of it being doctored? Would you read that?

Who knows what the shooters motives were. He could have self identified as a woman according to this. http://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2015/11/court-records-colorado-planned-parenthood-shooter-not-republican-identifies-as-woman/ All violence is horrible and YES if this guy is yelling the name of Jesus as he commits his crimes christains should and probably will come out and denounce it loudly and quickly. Likewise should the Muslims when murder is committed time and again in the name of Allahu.

And the next time I commit a crime I ‘ll shout out Sigourney!
All Sigourneys will then have to apologize and dissociate themselves from the crime. Ok, Tinkerbell?

Between the Lines, you are name calling and derisive of other’s views. This has been an intellectual discussion with an exchange of respectful opinions.
Either stop the name calling and ridiculing of other’s posts or go away! Grow up a little and stop bullying you are not in elementary school on the playground!

I say it as I see it……just as you are entitled to.
Freedom of speech is my right as well as yours.
Ok Lori Hulk? 😉

Do we know if the guy was religiously motivated? It’s an obvious
jump-to-conclusion, but living 60 miles away, I have been watching a lot
of reports, and the cops have said nothing about him beyond name and
hometown.

So this is the first time extremist Christians attacked an “abortion ” clinic?
He might be a weirdo and loner but he darn well knows why these places are targets.
Cut the excuses!

You have nothing to back up your ignorant statement. You are pointing a finger with no facts just like this political sh-it piece.

That is the main problem. Even when they are religiously motivated, you neither hear the word terrorist nor their religion associated with them when it’s a Non-Muslim person committing crime. But if it’s a Muslim who did it even if it was not religiously motivated, they make sure they include the word Muslim or Islam in the title along with the word terrorist. Not to mention, it will be shown by every main stream media 24/7. The media propaganda and bias is main reason behind all the hate for Islam and Muslims. Wake up people.

As he was arrested, he said, “No more body parts!” Quoting a lie reported by Carly Fiorina of Fox News.

No it was not a lie, IF Robert actually said that

Planned parenthood conceded that they sold body parts for research you leftist ignoramus.

Receiving compensation for costs incurred isn’t selling body parts, that means you just sinned against God by rejecting Jesus in your telling of lies to propagate hatred. Jesus described people like you as being one who has embraced Satan and evil and you’re indicative of what’s wrong with many conservative Christians. You believe that you’re morally superior to God and that you’re better than He is, you believe you can sin against Him all you want while pushing agendas that violate the teachings of Jesus.

When money is involved in a trade IT IS A SALE no matter how much ‘spin’ you want to put on it.

You can’t just change definitions when it is convenient.

But….it really goes like this

Planned parenthood can do anything no matter how wrong and gullible people like you will defend them. You are just arguing from confirmation bias and nothing more.

Actually, they never conceded that. What they said was that they legally get reimbursed for tissue procurement. There is a big difference, as I’m sure you know but refuse to acknowledge.

No there isn’t a difference

Any type of money involved even the act of trading is ‘selling’

This has been this way since currency was invented.

This is common sense, and since your bias is getting involved you won’t see this.